8/12/11 A MUST READ TRANSCRIPT: Town of Glenmore residents VS Town Chairman and Wind developers AND Not voting in favor of Big Wind? Then you've lost your right to vote.
Recent sign posted in the Brown County Town of Glenmore
"You’re setting yourself up for trouble, okay?"
-March 7, 2011: Wind developer to Town Board of Glenmore after Board moves to delay permitting project for 60 days.
NOTE FROM THE BPWI RESEARCH NERD:
One of the most eye-opening documents we've seen comes from a resident of the Town of Glenmore in Brown County who sent us a partial transcript of video and audio recording made during the March 2011 Town meeting regarding the granting of permits to a wind developer.
The developer is running out of time. The production tax credit deal runs out at the end of 2012 and if they miss the deadline they'll lose millions. When the board decides to postpone permitting the developers become angry.
"We could have put court injunctions in place to force you, but we never did, okay?"-March 7, 2011: Wind developer to Town Board of Glenmore after Board moves to delay permitting project for 60 days.
We're presenting this transcript exactly as it came to us and we thank the resident who allowed Better Plan to post it.
Setting the scene: Watch clips from the meeting by clicking on the image below. The story makes the local news after town chairman calls the cops on protesting residents. Chairman Kittell is in the red shirt.
March 7, 2011 Glenmore Town Board Meeting:
Building Permits for Prelude/CEnergy
Transcript demonstrates how board has handled the public in this matter, rejecting the pleas of state officials as well. Please watch the video entirely and take note of developers private comments to the board on the audio tape which was recorded by Lana Ossmann, Glenmore Town Clerk.
Andre Jaques, WI state assembly rep: Gives update from Madison and addresses issue of conditional use permits/retroactivity of new wind ordinance.
Rick Loppnow, Glenmore Resident, Farmer: opinion against wind turbines. Infringing on property rights. Moral question. Asks turbine-opposing residents to stand up, then questions the board who they really represent
Don Kittell, Glenmore Town Chairman: 10:23: had no choice in the matter, the attorneys for Prelude came in and said that the board had no choice but to put these up because of the state government they were working with. (??)
11:03, Lana Ossman, Glenmore Town Clerk: The gentlemen who was just up here is John Vanderleest and he was asked by Senator Lasee to be here.
Don Kittell: I think we’re done
Resident: Let him talk.
Don Kittell: This is a meeting, not a public hearing.
People get upset, Kittell gives in.
John Vanderleest, representing Senator Frank Lasee: Reiterates the suspension of PSC Ruling 128, on the basis of emergency for public health, safety, and welfare. John expresses Senator Lasee’s deep concern for the people of Glenmore and asks for the board to consider their new wind ordinance and the suspension of the PSC Ruling.
Don Kittell: rebuttles and disagrees with John.
16:45 Don Kittell: makes a motion to accept CG power solutions who bought out Prelude. Motion carried and accepted. Issue is raised by the town attorney that there are a few more documents that need completion for the building permits to be approved.
18:26 Don Kittell: I make the motion, with the few changes that Bob stated, to go ahead with the building permit. Motion made and seconded.
Resident: You’re going to do that to your citizens here?
Don Kittell: Well don’t holler at us, holler at da state.
Residents: This is ridiculous.
18:53 Residents start protesting and chanting “No Permits, No Permits.”
Don Kittell: calls 911 on the people for getting out of hand. People continue to civilly protest.
Don Kittell: Motion is made and seconded that we grant the building permits.
People start protesting again. Ron Nowak votes ‘no’ against the permits.
Don Kittell: Motion made and carried. (Chris Schmidt, town supervisor, never had an audible vote, Kittell passes it anyhow and moves on with the meeting despite people protesting and chanting) .
26:50 – good protests and pleading by the residents. Must listen. “Why would you experiment with your own people when you know there are big questions..” Kittell closes the meeting.
Pat Kolarik, Glenmore Resident: talks about the three families who are already suffering and why would the board want to pull the trigger on others. Talks about the state rebuking the wind turbine progress, so why would we not err on the side of waiting. Begs to reconsider..
31:40 Don Kittell: Where I’m comin from, the state made a law 5, I don’t know how many years ago it was and we granted a CUP 4 years ago on that. I don’t know what else we can do.
John Vanderleest: The state knows a lot more now than they did when this act 40 was created…. Obviously now the state is trying to go back and make it better for residents knowing that there are issues… They wanted to stop to make the rules even more difficult and you’re going below the state standard that was in place that the state is now going to amend and go higher, so I just don’t understand how that can make the residents safe in your area.
Don Kittell: where was da state? (On and on with the same argument about the state)..
John Vanderleest: tries to tell Kittell the state’s view is different, again, given the evidence
Don Kittell: why didn’t the shut everything down then? They didn’t. (He’s missing the point and trying to avoid the issue that he has the chance to stop the building permits right now)
Around 35:00- Andre Jaques explains the actions at the state for the town board and answers question of the town board.
39:31 Elaine Kittell- so who is going to pay the lawsuit because we’re going to get sued because we’re not allowing them to follow the ordinance that was in place at the time they got their permits. (how does she know this?)
Issues brought up regarding comments made by Rick Stadlman needing to follow the old ordinance that the Prelude turbines must go up. Question brought to Andre Jaques who speaks on retroactive issues. Don Kittell makes a few rebuttles and rouses the crowd and takes a few shots at the state and Andre to distract from having to rescind the motion.
43:10 Jon Morehouse, Morrison Resident- the conditional use that was granted is right here. Number 16 says any significant change or substation of the wind energy facility as shown, that the application requires that a new conditional use permit be obtained. Is there any question about that? Here it is right on the book, in black and white. Why then are you giving them two permits based on a conditional use .. .. (interruption by Don Kittell) that did not contain significant piece of information correctly that was brought to you in December, the fact that gl-518 was supposed to have a turbine and was mislabeled. The fact that you have a legal name on a piece of land is very significant. That also would bring that conditional use permit back to six turbines, not seven, you’re going for seven. It’s not on here, where is it. You can deny that permit based on the fact that this is not correct. You can deny it. Never mind the state, never mind anything else, you can deny it right here (applause).
This is your choice, this is not the state, you’re copin’ out. This is your choice, your doing. Live with that.
Kittell: I will
Rick Loppnow, Glenmore Resident: You guys are saying you issued this conditional use permit four years ago and… if you listen to Mr. Vanderleest, Senator Lasee is trying to explain that since then the state, if the state itself, not the town of Glenmore, the state says that federal setbacks pose a potential health risk and undue hardships on residents. On that case alone, I believe you could deny this because a public health emergency, that’s stated right in the (can’t make it out) and I ask again, who are you representing. Are you representing the wind turbine developers or the towns people that elected you.
45:40 Jim Vanden Boogart, Morrison Resident: You guys are talking about law suits and stuff and I kind of wonder if you’d rather spend the town’s money defending the town or fighting against your own people. .
Jon Morehouse, Morrison resident: There is a legal term called the “Precautionary Principle”, that is recognized in courts, our lands, and others, the Precautionary Principle protects people from potential health and safety issues. That’s exactly what these industrial wind turbines are doing with people. You can hang your hat on that and it’s not a shameful thing for these turbine people to sue a town because they’re not getting their permits. Let em do it. Let the people pay that lawsuit as opposed to having to pay against their own selves.
Don Kittell: goes on about where is the town going to get the money for a lawsuit.
Rick Loppnow, Glenmore Resident: Don, you’re going to have a lawsuit either way.
Don Kittell: Fine!
Rick Loppnow: Then why would you choose to go with the wind turbine companies? Would you rather be sued by the wind turbine company out of Chicago, or would you rather be sued by your neighbors and friends.
Nancy Peotter, Glenmore Resident: You don’t have to ignore the science, the science is out there now. She goes on about scientific research as evidence and uses national examples to support her opinion.
50:00 Pat Kolarik, Glenmore Resident: That’s all these people are saying Don…. The joint review committee for the state said this is an emergency. Their decision is based on an emergency…. It says the Joint Committee suspended the public service commission rules, and I quote, Senator Lasee quote, ‘on the basis of testimony received at a Feb. 9, 2011 meeting, on the grounds that the content of PSC Chapter 128 create an emergency relating to public health, safety, and welfare, are arbitrary and capricious and impose an undue hardship on landowners and residents adjacent to wind turbine sites as stated in section 227.19. So that was their decision, that’s what they came up with, that it is an emergency. So you have a right. And what the folks are saying at this point that if the wind turbine companies want to sue, let em sue because the flip side is, the people that are being harmed or if their land’s taken away, they’re going to sue, so the town board’s the first line of defense to protect it’s people. You’re the first line of defense. The state says, it creates an emergency. Now I know what they said 4 years ago, 4 minutes ago.
Don Kittell: 6 years ago! And they didn’t care and they still don’t!!! (He’s not listening to anything)
Protests from residents
Don Kittell: they’re awfully slow learning
Resident: Yeah but, Donny, look how long it’s taking you to get it.
Don Kittell: I still didn’t!
52:49 Pat Kolarik, Glenmore Resident: It’s not anything to do with you guys, what decisions you made before. We have to look at today. There’s more measurement out there, and if nothing else, and Lana, you got the list for God’s sakes, there’s three families on there that are suffering problems. They’re our neighbors! So we’ve got the measurement on 8 turbines that haven’t even been up 4 months. That should be enough.
Don Kittell: Who’s ta list, why didn’t dey call me?
Grumblings from residents
Resident: My Father called you.
Don Kittell: he called me and I told him to talk to the wind turbine company. And if you remember, I asked him why he didn’t speak to the wind turbine people.
Speaker who’s parents are residents: (hard to make out) My mother suffered with pressure on the ears, headaches. My father had issues with that – agitation, (hard to make out, air conditioning noise) … My parents may not be able to stay because of this,…. I just hope they can put off the vote for a few more months until more info is gathered and the state has more information… that is my concern. (applause)
Jon Morehouse, Morrison Resident: Don, your town attorney is sitting right here, having had him witness what’s going on, maybe we could as what’s his take right now.. from the town’s aspect, not Don’s aspect.
Attoney Gagon refuses to comment.
Attendants plead to open the meeting again.
Cliff Hammond, Morrison Resident: Your lawyer just made a comment that he works for the town board, who does the town board work for? I thought you worked for the people that elected you to cover their butts?
Watch their back, not let em get sick, any kind of injuries or problem from the wind turbines? You’re not doin’ that. Don, you said a few minutes ago that you were getting forced into doing this. Any force I see coming from you has been your own mind. Your townspeople don’t want you to do it. Nobody else wants you to do it. The three or four representatives from the wind turbine people want you to do it. You want to do it because I think it’s your last act of defiance because you’re not running for town chairman again, is that what it is? Or do you want to represent the people that put you in that office for 32 years? I think you should reconvene this meeting, have a revote, and vote your conscience, not what you think you want to do as (hard to make out)
57: 35 Residents start asking for a revote, questioning by the attendant whose parents are going to have to leave their home.
Resident: What is the reason you need to make a choice tonight?
Don Kittell: Four years.
Rick Loppnow, Glenmore Resident: I spoke with all three members of the town board this weekend and they all told me that the turbine company wanted this done before March 1st because they needed it for their permits and I feel that’s why the town board is making a decision tonight, they’re not looking at all of the input from the state who told about all of the health emergencies and you’re not listening. And the only reason you’re passing them tonight instead of holding off for a month or two months to see what the state does is because these people here need em passed to get their turbines up so they can start making their money.
Cliff Hammond, Morrison Resident: Why don’t you poll your towns people, not everyone here, and ask them if they’d like a re-vote and if you would like to do that for them? I think that’s the least you could do. With the evidence that was given tonight by the representatives and the state senate- why they shot down those PSC rules, is more than enough evidence and more than enough reason to reject that building permit. You got it in writing from the state. You keep saying the state hasn’t done anything, they just did 3 weeks ago. Ask your townspeople.
Jeff Jens, Glenmore Resident: Brings to attention that the turbine people are not denying that a health emergency won’t happen.
Steve Deslauries, Holland town Resident: If they (the developers) were a good neighbor, were a good corporation, were good people, they would voluntarily let the town board postpone this decision for a few months until the state works it out, but you know as well as I do that these people want these things in before a state decision is because they’re afraid of what might happen. They’re afraid that the state might side with the people of Wisconsin for a change and these good neighbors that we see IN THE ROOM, they should voluntarily, if they are truly good neighbors and good people for this community, they would voluntarily say, ‘let’s put off this decision for a couple months, we’re not going to sue you in a couple months, lets do the right thing for people in this community. You’re not a good neighbor if you don’t do that. I ask you to please do that. Why do you shake your head? Explain that shake.. No, hold it. The gentleman here is shaking his head, I’d like to understand what the thinking is behind that shake. These people are experiencing problems with the same set backs you are proposing. Please talk to us. Voluntarily do it, be a good neighbor. Be what you say you are.
Pat Kolarik, Glenmore Resident: I know that Tom Mattson said that we are all beautiful people and he doesn’t want to hurt us. That was quoted somewhere. March 2007 meeting. March 2007 Tom Mattson said you are all beautiful people and I would never do anything against you.
1:01:00 More asking for a revote, grumbling. What is the rush.
1:03:50 Steve Deslauries, Holland town Resident: Since day one Don, the town has been able to regulate on health and safety, it always been the case, that’s never changed, the town has always had the power to regulate on health and safety, that has never changed. The only thing that would have changed that was the state-wide rules that were just suspended on the day they were to go in effect. So this whole time, from 2005 to 2000 to 1995, that’s been the same thing. The town can regulate on health and safety. You have chosen not to do so, that is not the state’s fault, that is on you guys. Now you have the chance to do this right, post-pone it. Say no. Say that you have not risen to the level of health and safety in your township. This is your chance to do the right thing Don. We beg you to do it. We beg you. Please
Don Kittell: Who decides the health and safety (can someone shoot me?)
Crowd becomes aggravated again and brings up the families who are having problems with the turbines. .
Resident: Your making a health and safety decision right now. You asked the question. You’re putting your people at risk for not having given the proper audience to the problems that occur with wind turbine deals. You are indeed trying to make a health decision on your people.
Resident: Donny, can you table the approval with the next meeting being about the health and safety with information about health and safety. the issues that are going on, some of them that were mentioned in Madison
Some of them that are mention that are somewhat measurable or measurable. Can you table it or postpone it or give that extra month or two months? ….
Lori Morehouse, Morrison Resident: Mr. Kittell, my husband and I asked to be on the agenda for January. We went to the first international conference on the adverse health effects of wind turbines that was last October in Ontario, Canada. And we presented our information to the Morrison town board, and we asked to be on the agenda for this town board for January and we were denyed that. So we would be glad to share with you what we learned at that conference. We had doctors from all around the world telling about the adverse health effects living next to wind turbines. And what these people getting paid. So we’d be willing 18:10 to share this information with the town board so we can get that information to you. Thank you.
1:06:47 Cliff Hammond, Morrison Resident: I would think just as a good civil servant, if you’ve got three families that are affected, Don, if you’re saying you haven’t talked to em yet? How can you make the decision on what’s gonna affect how many other families in your township if you don’t (coughing on tape covering voice), if you can get all three of those families in and talk to em and find out what the problem is. Don’t keep telling em to call the wind companies, you know what they’re gonna do. They’re gonna say, well our wind turbines don’t create any health and safety issues at all. They’ve been sayin’ that for years. How come everybody that lives around a wind turbine farm is havin’ the same problem? Find out from the people in your town next to the 8 turbines that have only been running for 4 months, find out what’s going on with them. Get to the bottom of it. You’re their civil servant, you’re their protector, you gotta do it.
Resident: Don, are you suggesting that those three people are just making those stories up. Those three families?
Don Kittel: Nope.
Resident: You don’t care about em?
1:07:56 Don Kittell: Yep, I talked to two of em, the third one I don’t know about (but Don, earlier in the meeting you said you didn’t know of the list) They are workin’ with the wind people and the wind people are working with them.
Residents pleading with the board to reconsider.
Steve Deslauries, Holland town Resident: We’re beggin you Don, please open up the meeting again.
1:09:00 People try to convince Don Kittell to reopen the meeting, remind the board why they were elected, reiterating that the state has declared an emergency situation to suspend the rules. Doing this in a responsible manner. No shouting. Appealing to the board in a calm MANNER.
1:14:30 – Don Kittell: What do you guys want to do
Supervisor: We need to talk to the lawyer on this. Do we put it on hold?
Don Kittell: Where do we put a hold on it til? Lawyer Bob Gagnon talks to board. Inaudible.
1:18:16 Don Kittell: Motion to go back into the regular meeting, the second motion I am going to make is to delay this for 60 days until we hear something from the state.
(applause & cheering, Kittell tells the people to settle down or they would be removed)
1:18:40 Developers approach the board to talk to them in a very low tone. Audio is broken.
Developer one (to the board): We patiently sat and you guys let us speak here before you go forward with the motion, this is not a court of opinion, it’s the court of law, the law rules. You could have passed this.
Resident: We can’t hear!! (They are essentially having a closed session meeting up at the front)
Developer One: If we could have passed.. We could have passed this with a hundred supporters, so that … hundred supporters versus the opponents. You’ve gotta go by law.
1:19:13 Developer two: we gave you what you wanted
Developer one: We gave you exactly what you wanted
Developer two: It’s not… we don’t…. it’s not. The vote is..
Developer one: There are people in this town, okay… Not even 10% showed up. The minority has control. They make a lot of noise. Absolutely, ok? Absolutely. Are you going to vote on the minority? Or are you gonna, on the minority? The majority is obviously accepting the way that you are governing the town otherwise they would be here telling you otherwise. And I understand their passion about what it means about the health risks, okay, but that’s unfair to the board, they’re, they’re pandering the board when they do that. is the next thing gonna be that they’re going to ask the board to outlaw smoking in the town of Glenmore because cigarettes kill? You can’t fall for the passion. You’ve gotta apply law. Law. In the court of law is what rules, not the court of appeal . okay? And, and if you.. nothing’s gonna change. Don, you’re, don’t… accept the legislator’s (??) And it’s biased opinion. We kill (really, this is what he said 1:20:44) uh..opponents, and we understand that, we knew that was going to happen, we’re not afraid of that..
Developer two: Do they understand what the vote is for? We already have our information, we already have the CUP.
Developer one: The debate is over. The debate was over years ago. It’s law. We purchased it because it was done. All we’re asking for is to go get my permit. I’m not asking whether or not.. I already have this..
Kittell: Shhhh.
Developer one: I do not envy the position you’re in. Absolutely not, okay? Absolutely not. I know the pressures you’re under, but again, 90%, 94% of your population is not here. And the bulk is they’re satisfied with the way you guys are governing this town, the, the minority, you’ve gotta, you can’t let the minority (screw?) you the law. Who knows what the state’s gonna do, yes the wind siting was the only bill that Walker brought to the floor was knocked down, because everybody said, ‘wait a minute.. okay? We don’t like that.’ That was a (??) tax bill. (muffled) job affected by it was health. Walker was smart enough to pull it out. This thing is going to get fought forever. There’s no way in a month. In 60 days, you’re not gonna have any more permission than you have now. I have friends with turbines in their fricken back yards.. I know the industry, I understand the industry, we’re not a big faceless corporation, we’re here, we’re here trying to be good corporate citizens to the town of Glenmore. Don, you and I talked.. they talked to you about, I mean.. you and I talked.. the debate in this town, as it pertains to law has been gone through. They had their opportunity, like you said, over many months. We have been patiently waiting for months, patiently waiting for months for the board to recognize that we’ve completed what was asked of us. Ok? So if they were that passionate about it, they’ve had months and months and months to kill this. Okay? So..
(Residents did show up at the meetings, brought concerns, and protested the turbines. Please request audio tapes from Lana Ossman, town clerk, going back to mid-2006. See attached information regarding minutes.
Developer one: If you give em the VOTE today, what’s it gonna be tomorrow? What’s it gonna be?
Developer two: well, not for you Don, you won’t be around after April. (laughter at the table)
Developer Two: We’ve already went on the record. You gave us what we want. (now it’s reversed or did they realize what they said earlier and are trying to back pedal)
Developer One: Proceed with the rest of the meeting, the rest of the agenda. It’s the law. Take the burden off, say listen, these people are coming into our town and they’re making decisions based on law. And we’re governing based off law. You can’t govern off of opinion. I don’t want any more.
Developer Two: I just want what I. I paid for it. I paid all the fees and I just want what I came for.
Developer One: You know, I understand there’s people that hurt, playing their cards. There’s significant scientific evidence that parts coming off brand-new cars that affects a certain percentage of the population, so what are we going to do, stop driving cars, go back to horse and carriage? Scientific evidence that the rural farming community- the air is full of pesticides and the ground water and it’s significantly impacting. What are we going to do? Stop farming? Stop putting pesticides into the ground? I’m not saying, it’s a.. purposely on somebody, but you can’t chase shadows forever. Okay, you have to go by law. You know, it’s not your out, but that’s your response to the people. You hired us to govern and manage this town by the law and that’s what we’re doing. OK? You’re charged with governing this town and protecting the public health, but the public health … you’ve gotta outlaw the legislative (???) … toxic fumes that are coming off the fuel? Nobody in this town can smoke a cigarette within the town limits? That’s the precedence they’re asking you to set here. Where does it stop? So, you’ve made your decision based on the laws. Okay. And that’s where it’s gotta stop, right there. Not in a court of opinion.
Don Kittell: Okay, step back.
Inaudible for several minutes
1:27:30 Motion to open up the town board meeting.
1:27:44 Kriss Schmidt, Glenmore Supervisor: I’m gonna make da motion that we delay for 60 days. See what da state does.
Ron Nowak, Glenmore Supervisor: I’ll second that.
Kittell: Okay, motion made and seconded that we delay 60 days on this decision. Da state hasn’t done anything, then they just start, right?
Lana Ossmann, Glenmore town clerk: The motion is to delay for 60 days until you hear from the state, did you want to change that to include something else or is that the end of the motion? Delay for 60 days until you hear from the state? Okay, reconsider..
Developer approaches the board: Voice one and two: Excuse me, can I approach the board? On what basis are you reconsidering? For the record, I’d like to know why you’re reconsidering. What are we missing in our documents that you’re reconsidering? I want it on the record.
Developer two: I want to know what law have we violated, what legislation have we violated,
Developer one: what documents are we missing? Because you strictly (lowers voice) the board made a decision on the record, okay, and then the meeting was closed,
Resident: Why don’t you have a speaker instead of being right down in front please?
Developer One: and based on public opinion…
Resident: Don’t treat our town board like that.
Developer One: and based on public opinion you changed the rule. You’re setting yourself up for trouble, okay?
Resident: Back up so we can hear?
Developer One: I don’t care if everybody heard, okay? Listen, simply what we’re saying is.. If we were afraid of hearing what everybody said, if we were a nameless, faceless corporation, we wouldn’t come here, we’d send an attorney and say do our business for us, but that’s not what we’re about. OK? We’re here because sincerely we want to be good corporate citizens, so most importantly, and what everybody has to understand, I grew up in Canada, you want to see a background full of turbines, come to Ontario some time and drive down the road and just sit back and see the..
Short Protest by crowd.
Developer One: Just!!!!.... I quietly sat there and listened to everybody in the same respect, okay, and trust me, I’m not going to cuss at ya like some d id to me. I’m not going to call some of the names that some did to me., okay, I’m gonna treat you with respect. Very simply, there’s a court of opinion and a court of law. We came to the good state of Wisconsin and the town of Glenmore based on law. Okay? And what you’re asking the town board to do is violate law. You voted each one of these individuals in here. There is no law. Okay? Their original decision was based on law, yes it was, okay? So you voted them in to represent you, okay, and not compromise the town in any way from a legal perspective, from anything else but a legal perspective and that’s what...
1:30 48: Resident: You can’t isolate (grumbling from crowd)
Kittell: HOLD IT EVERYBODY! HOLD IT!! QUIET, UDDERWISE I’LL HAVE THE POLICE OFFICER CLEAR DA ROOM.
Developer One: Okay? And that’s what they did. And then as far as the health concerns? Basically what you’re asking them to do, okay, is if you get enough people in a room, if you get enough people in a room and say, you know what? The toxicity of, the toxicity related to filling your car up with gas, smoking a cigarette, I assume this room is full of non-smokers, right? I assume? Okay? so if your asking him, if you’re asking the board to represent you from health purposes? Then you might as well ask them to outlaw cigarettes in the town of Glenmore.
Groan from the crowd
Developer One: You might as well ask them to outlaw filling up their cars with gasoline, NO ! it’s the same thing!
Resident: Our state ruled, they just ruled.
Developer One: No, there’s no rule.
Crowd rebu ttles
Developer One: IF there was legislation, if there was clearly legislation that would clearly give the board a direction, Chris told you tonight, he very clearly asked, their original decision was based on law, okay? And they very patiently allowed you people to keep talking, okay, as neighbors and friends, okay? They basically wanted to give in to that, okay? You put em in a very difficult position.
Crowd gets upset
Resident: Are you sayin’ you won’t give em 60 days?
Steve Deslauries: Yeah, as a good corporate citizen, why would you…
Developer One: What we’re saying is, when a company comes in and makes decisions based off law, okay, it’s not a matter of whether we can or can’t, you make decisions, you operate a business based on law, so the fact of the matter is we say, okay, arbitrarily we’re gonna wait. So Is the good town of Glenmore going to give us hundreds of thousands of dollars for the cost of money while we wait for the ultimate decision that we’re gonna get cause I can guarantee you the state’s not gonna…
Protests from crowd
Developer One: Listen, okay? Listen… okay? I’m not gonna get into a debate. I sat there and listened and I’m telling you- There’s a court of law and there’s a court of opinon, so if we brought in a hundred people or two hundred people in this room and they all out voted you, would you expect the board just to go along.. I just said they’re making a decision based off law.
1:33:42 Steve Deslauries: Now it’s your opportunity.. the prudent thing - The state ruled there an emergency based on, hold on, health, safety, and welfare, period. So that’s the decision of the state right now. They’re saying in 6 months, there’s going to be new rules. So what you’re actually after today will show to the town the type of corporate citizen and how much you care about Glenmore. The town board is asking for a very reasonable thing- 60 days. Your actions, after tonight’s meeting will prove to the township what type of corporate citizen you are. And if you generally care about Glenmore, all we’re saying is, the state has questioned it, now lets go do due-diligence and make sure it’s right before you move forward.
Developer One: But we’ve done that.
Crowd rebuttles.
Developer One: We submitted in September.
Pat Kolarik, head of Plan Commission: And the reason you didn’t get your permit is because your documents weren’t complete
Developer One: And we’ve done that, we’ve completed the documents.
Pat Kolarik: In the mean time, our state of Wisconsin, not Canada, has suspended the rules and said, do I have to say it again, do I have to read it again? that it is an emergency! They said the word ‘emergency’! Senators and representatives from our assembly said it is an emergency!
Resident: Not corporate Chicago.
Developer One: our documentation was completed prior to the suspension.
Resident: Now we’re doing due diligence. And we’re saying, “we don’t agree with you, we have concerns.”
Developer one: and we respect that.
Crowd argues back.
Developer One: Where were you three years ago when the issue..
Crowd goes into rage because the residents were there three years ago.
1:35:28 Developer: (to Don Kittell) Don, This is going to go on forever.
Developer Two: This is going to go on forever
Developer One: It’s not going to end in 60 days, we gave you what you wanted.
Developer Two: We gave you what you wanted.
(Jesus, are they clones?)
Developer One: Don, you promised us this wouldn’t be a debate, okay?
Don Kittell: I didn’t open it up as a public hearing. The meeting is basically closed.
Someone: you voted to open the meeting again.
Developer One: I know, Don, that’s what I’m saying.
Pat Kolarik: Please respect our town board and step away from their face, that is rude.
Residents and crowd get very upset that the developers are talking to the board with their backs toward the audience, public can not hear what is going on, essentially a closed session at the board table. Much yelling from crowd to speak so everyone can hear.
1:36:23 Developer One: I’m serious guys, your violating.. we.. we.. okay… answer everything…. everything asked for and provided since the beginning of the year and we respected … WORKED with you guys.. we could have put court injunctions in place to force you, but we never did, okay? So if you’re telling us we should have done that, then the big evil.. … (someone interrupts, asking them to back up) All we’re asking you is to rule for the court of law. That’s all we’re asking.
Developer Three?: This is the courts, your ordinance in processes, that this is pretty much everything has been submitted, everything’s been considered, these..
Unknown (presumably a developer) You gave us the rules, we followed em
Developer One: Yeah
Unknown (presumably a developer): Now you’re breakin’ the rules.
Developer One: Now your tellin’ those rules we asked you to follow- We don’t like those rules?
Protests and a reminder to the town who they need to represent.
Whispering at the board table. Inaudible. Mention of court. Board trying to figure out how to word the rescinding of the earlier motion.
1:39:40 Motion to rescind the initial motion of the meeting to approve the building permits. Motion to delay building permit for 60 days.
Applause and cheers.
Proceed with the remainder of the agenda
FROM NEW YORK STATE
PRO-WIND CAPE VINCENT COUNCILMEN ATTEMPT TO STOP SEASONALS FROM VOTING
READ ENTIRE ARTICLE AT SOURCE: watertowndailytimes.com
August 12, 2011
By JAEGUN LEE TIMES STAFF WRITER,
CAPE VINCENT — Three pro-wind town councilmen passed a resolution Wednesday night in an illegal attempt to prevent seasonal residents from voting in upcoming local elections.
The resolution, which passed 3-2 at the regular council meeting, requires voters to show their state driver’s licenses, with a Cape Vincent address, at the polls to vote in a town election.
The motion was made by Councilman Donald J. Mason, who said the resolution was in response to a petition submitted the same night and signed by more than 200 residents that argued that “unethical, if not illegal, voting methods were implemented to manipulate” the outcome of local elections in Cape Vincent.
Mr. Mason’s motion was seconded by Councilman Marty T. Mason, and Councilman Mickey W. Orvis cast the deciding vote, despite several attempts from fellow board members to persuade the three not to pass an illegal measure.
“I think this is just garbage,” said Councilman Brooks J. Bragdon, who voted “no” along with Supervisor Urban K. Hirschey. “This law here frivolously overrules an existing law that is run competently by the Board of Elections in Watertown and I don’t think we have, even remotely, the right to do that.”
Supervisor Hirschey strongly advised the three councilmen to seek legal consultation from town attorney Mark G. Gebo before taking a vote.
“Do you want to be putting yourselves in jeopardy by voting on something that’s illegal?” Mr. Hirschey asked. “It’s up to the voter to decide where he wants to vote.”
Mr. Bragdon pointed out that seasonal residents easily outnumbered year-round residents — with approximately 5,200 seasonal and 2,700 year-round residents in the town of Cape Vincent.
“I think the people who have come here and invested a substantial amount of capital or a high percentage of everything that they own have the right to express themselves on issues that exist in Cape Vincent,” Mr. Bragdon said. “The issue has become redolent of self-interest, redolent of wind, redolent of getting money directly for oneselves, and with all respect for my board members, they should not be running for office and they should not be proposing a vote to curtail (seasonal) votes, in their favor.”
Councilmen Marty and Donald Mason, who are seeking re-election this November, both have leases with wind farm developers.
The petition that sparked the debate was submitted by Harold L. Wiley, who started gathering signatures after learning that a recent voter registration drive resulted in more than 200 seasonal residents signing up to vote in the September Republican primary and November general election.
“In my opinion, it’s voter fraud,” Mr. Wiley said. “I used to know everybody in Cape Vincent. But among those 250 voters, I’d be surprised if I knew more than 10 people.”
Donald Mason said that the resolution “has nothing to do with wind” and that he didn’t “think anybody would be against stopping voter fraud.”
State election law states that a person can vote in a local election as long as he or she is a U.S. citizen who meets all the requirements to register to vote in the state and has “lived in the county, city or village for at least 30 days before the election.”
The BPRC Research Nerd
in Wind developers behaving badly, Wind farm, wind energy, wind power, wind turbine
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